MarginaliaThe copy of Sir Edward Bayntons letter to M. Latymer.MAster Latymer, after harty recommendations, I haue communicated the effect of your letters to diuers of my frendes,MarginaliaThese friendes of Master Baynton seme to be some popishe priestes and enemies to the Gospel, as Pinel, Wilson, Sherewood, Hubberdine, etc. such as for Christen charitie (as they say) rather desire in you a reformation, either in your opinion (if it swarue from the truth) or at the least in your maner and behauiour, in asmuch as it geueth occasion of sclaunder and trouble in let of your good purposes, then any other inconuenience to your person or good name. And for asmuch as your sayd letter misliked them in some part, and that I haue such confidence in your Christen breste, as in my iudgement ye will conformably and gladly, both heare that may be reformed in you, and also (as it is worthy) so knowledge and cōfesse the same: I haue therfore desired them to take the payne to note their myndes in this letter which I send to you, as aggregate of theyr sayinges, and sent from me your assured frend and fauourer, in that that is the very truth of Gods word, wherein neuertheles, as I trust ye your selfe will temper your owne iudgement, and in a sobernes affirme no truth of your selfe, which shoulde diuide the vnitie of the congregation in CHRIST,MarginaliaThe Papistes will not haue vnitie disturbed. and the receiued truth agreed vppon by holy fathers of the Church,MarginaliaPapistrie coloured with authority of holy Fathers. consonant to the Scripture of God, euen so what so euer ye will do therein (as I thinke ye will not otherwise then ye should do) I beyng vnlearned, and not of the knowledge to geue sentence in this altercation and contention, must rather of good congruence shewe my selfe in that you disagree with thē, readyer to folow their doctrine in truth, then yours, MarginaliaM. Baynton will folow the most nūber.vnles it may please almighty God to inspire and confirme the hartes of such people to testifie the same in some honest number as ought to induce me to geue credence vnto them.

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MarginaliaNote the proceding of the Popes church, which would not haue the people certeine of Gods truth and religion.Onely God knoweth the certaine truth, which is cōmunicate vnto vs, as our capacitie may comprehende it by fayth, but that is per speculū in enigmate.  

And there haue bene qui zelū Dei habuerunt, sed non secūdum scientiā.  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Sir Edward Baynton to Latimer, quoting from I Corinthians, 12. 12 and Romans, 10. 2.

Foxe text Latin

per speculum in enigmate ... qui zelum Dei habuerunt, sed non secundum scientiam

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

through a mirror on a mystery ... those who had a zeal for God, but not in accordance with their understanding

Actual text of I Corinthians, 12. 12. and Romans 10. 2.

videmus nunc per speculum in enigmate ... [testimonium enim perhibeo] illis [quod] aemulationem Dei habent sed non secundum scientiam.

Among which I repute not you, but to this purpose I write it, that to call this or that truth it requireth a deepe and profound knowledge, considering that to me vnlearned, that I take for truth, may be otherwise, not hauyng sensus exercitatos,   as S. Paul sayth, ad discernēdū bonū & malū:  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Sir Edward Baynton to Latimer, quoting from Hebrews, 5. 14.

Foxe text Latin

sensus exercitatos ... ad discernendum bonum & malum

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

feelings roused to distinguish between good and evil.

Actual text of Hebrews, 5. 14 (Vulgate)

eorum qui pro consuetudine exercitatos habent sensus ad discretionem boni ac mali.

and it is shewed me, that an opinion or maner of teachyng, which causeth dissension in a Christian congregation, is not of God,MarginaliaError and false doctrine would fayne lye still in peace & not be stirred. by the doctrine of S. Iohn in his Epistle, where hee sayth: Omnis qui confitetur Christum in carne. &c. ex Deo est.  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Sir Edward Baynton to Latimer, quoting from I John, 4. 2.

Foxe text Latin

Omnis qui confitetur Christum in carne &c. ex Deo est.

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

Everyone who confesses Christ in the flesh ... is of God.

Actual text of I John, 4. 2.

omnis spiritus qui confitetur Iesum Christum in carne venisse ex Deo est.

[Accurate citation except for the omission ofspiritusin line 1 and ofvenissein line 2.]

And lyke as the worde of God hath alwayes caused dissension among men vnchristened, whereupon hath ensewed and folowed Martyrdome to the Preacher: so in CHRISTES congregation among them that profeße CHRISTES name, In vno Domino, vno Baptismate & vna fide,  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Sir Edward Baynton to Latimer, citing Ephesians 4. 4.

Foxe text Latin

In vno Domino, vno Baptismate, & vna fide

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

In one lord, one baptism and in one faith

Actual text of Ephesians, 4. 4. (Vulgate)

unus Dominus una fides unum baptisma

[Clearly this passage in Ephesians is indicated, although the original text is all in the nominative case.

See below, page 1915, column 1, line 46 for a repetition of this citation.]

MarginaliaVnitie in the lord, in Baptisme & in fayth. they that preach and styrre rather contention, then charitie, though they can defend their saying, yet their teachyng is not to be taken as of God, in that it breaketh the chayne of Christen charitie,MarginaliaThe Chayne of christian charitie. and maketh diuision in the people, congregate and called by God into an vnitie of fayth and Baptisme. But for this poynt I would pray to God, that not onely in the truth may be agreement, but also such sobernes and vniforme behauiour vsed in teachyng and preachyng, as men may wholy expreße (as they may) the charitie of God, tendyng onely to the vnion in loue of vs all, to the profite and saluation of our soules.

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MarginaliaAnswer of Master Latymer to Master Bayntons letter.RIght worshipful Syr, and my singular good master, salutem in Christ Iesu, with dewe commendation and also thankes for your great goodnes towardes me &c. And where as you haue communicate my last letters to certayne of your frendes, which rather desire this or that in me &c. what I thinke therein I will not now say, not for that there coulde be any perill or daunger in the sayde letters (well taken) as farre as I can iudge, but for that they were rashly and vndeuisedly scrybled, as ye might well know both by my excuse, and by them selues also, though none excuse had bene made. And besides that, ye know right well, that where as the Bee gathereth hony,MarginaliaThe Bee. euen there the Spinner gathereth venome,MarginaliaThe Spinner. not for any diuersity of the flower, but for diuerse natures in them that sucketh the flower: MarginaliaEuery thing is as it is taken.As in times past, and in the beginning, the very truth, and one thing in it selfe was to some, offence, to some foolishnes, to other otherwise disposed, the wysdome of God. Such diuersitie was in the redresse of hearers thereof.

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But this notwithstanding, there is no more but either my writing is good, or bad: if it be good, the communicating thereof to your friendes can not be hurtful to me: if it be otherwise, why should you not communicate it to them, which both coulde and woulde instruct you in the truth, and reforme my errour. Let this passe, I wyll not contend: MarginaliaHad I wist.had I wyst commeth euer out of season. Truly I were not wel aduised if I would not eyther be glad of your instructiō, or yet refuse myne owne reformation, but

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yet it is good for a man to looke or he leapeth: and God forbyd that you shoulde bee addict and sworne to me so wretched a foole, that you should not rather follow the doctrine of your frendes in truth, so great learned mē as they appeare to be, then the opinions of me, hauyng neuer so Christen a brest.

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Wherefore do as you will: for as I would not if could, so can I not if I would, be noysome vnto you: but yet I say, I would my letters had bene vnwritten, if for none other cause, at lest way, in asmuch as they cause me to more writyng, an occupation nothyng meete for my mad head: and as touching pointes which in my foresaid letters mislike your frendes, I haue now litle laysure to make an aunswere thereto for the great busines that I haue in my litle cure.MarginaliaExample of a true diligent pastor. I know not what other mē haue in their great cures, seing þ^t I am alone without any priest to serue my cure, without my scholer to read vnto me, without any booke necessary to be loked vpon, without learned men to come and counsell withall.MarginaliaM. Latymer vnfurnished with outward helpes. All which thinges other haue at hand abundantly: but some thyng must be done, how so euer it be. I pray you take it in good worth, as long I temper mine owne iudgement, affirming nothing with preiudice of better. First ye mislike, that I say I am sure that I preach the truth,MarginaliaM. Latymer blamed for saying: he was sure of the truth which he preached. saying in reprofe of the same, that God knoweth certaine truth. In deede alonely God knoweth all certaine truth, & alonely God knoweth it as of him selfe, & none knoweth certaine truth but God, & those which be taught of God, as saith S. Paul: Deus enim illis patefecit  

: And CHRIST him selfe: erunt omnes docti a Deo.  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton

Foxe text Latin

erunt omnes docti a deo

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

They will all have been taught by God

And your frends deny not but that MarginaliaAs God alone knoweth all truth: so some truth he reueleth to be certayn to his seruauntes.certaine truth is communicate to vs, as our capacitie may comprehend it by faith, which if it be truth, as it is, then there ought no more to bee required of any man, but accordyng to his capacitie: now certaine it is that euery man hath not like capacitie. &c.But as to my presumption and arrogancie: MarginaliaIt is no presūption in a preacher being certaine of that which he preacheth, to shew it to the people.either I am certaine or vncertaine that it is truth that I preach. If it be truth, why may I not say so, to courage my hearers to receiue the same more ardently, and ensue it more studiously? If I be vncertaine, why dare I be so bold to preach it?MarginaliaLet no man preach except he be certayne of that which he preacheth. And if your frendes in whom ye trust so greatly, be preachers them selues, after their Sermon I pray you aske thē whether they be certaine and sure, that they taught you the truth or no, and send me word what they say, that I may learne to speake after them. If they say they be sure, ye know what foloweth: If they say they be vnsure, when shal you be sure that hath so doubtfull teachers and vnsure? MarginaliaEuery true christian ought to be certayne of his fayth.And you your selues, whether are you certaine or vncertaine, that CHRIST is your Sauiour, & so forth of other Articles that ye be bounden to beleue, or whether be ye sure or vnsure, that ciuile ordinaunces be the good workes of God, & that you do God seruice in doing of them, if ye do them for good intent: if ye bee vncertaine, take heede he be your sure frend that heareth you say so: and then, with what conscience do you doubt: Cum quicquid non est ex fide, peccatum sit?  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from Romans, 14. 23.

Foxe text Latin

Cum quicquid non est ex fide, peccatum sit?

[As in1563,except for the subjunctivesitreplacing the indicativeest]

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

Whenever what is not of faith is a sin?

Actual text of Romans, 14. 23. (Vulgate)

quia non ex fide omne autem quod non ex fide peccatum est.

But contrary say you, alonely God knoweth certaine truth, & ye haue it but per speculum in enigmate:  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from I Corinthians, 12. 12 and Romans, 10. 2.

Foxe text Latin

per speculum in aenigmate ... qui zelum dei habuerunt, sed non secundum scientiam

[See above page 1913, column 1, line 32]

MarginaliaThe doubting doctrine of the Catholickes. and there haue bene, qui zelum Dei habuerunt, sed non secundum scientiam:  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from I Corinthians, 12. 12 and Romans, 10. 2.

Foxe text Latin

per speculum in aenigmate ... qui zelum dei habuerunt, sed non secundum scientiam

[See above page 1913, column 1, line 32]

and to call this or that truth, it requireth a deepe knowledge, cōsidering that to you vnlearned, that you take for truth may be otherwise, not hauing sensus exercitatos  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from Hebrews, 5. 14.

Foxe text Latin

sensus exercitatos ... ad discernendum bonum & malum

[See above page 1913, column 1, line 36]

(as Paul saith) ad discernendum bonum & malum,  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from Hebrews, 5. 14.

Foxe text Latin

sensus exercitatos ... ad discernendum bonum & malum

[See above page 1913, column 1, line 36]

as ye reason agaynst me: and so you do best to know surely nothing for truth at all, but to wander meekely hether and thether, omni vento doctrinæ. &c.  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from Ephesians, 4. 14.

Foxe text Latin

omni vento doctrinae

Foxe text translation

Not translated.

Translation (Wade 2003)

with every wind of teaching

Actual text of Ephesians, 4. 14. (Vulgate)

et circumferamur omni vento doctrinae.

[Accurate citation]

MarginaliaArgument.Our knowledge here, you say, is but per speculum in enigmate. What then? Ergo it is not certaine and sure?

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MarginaliaAnswere.I deny your argumēt by your leaue: yea if it be by faith, as ye say, it is much sure, quia certitudo fidei est maxima certitudo,  

Marginaliai. The certenty of fayth is the most surest certayntie. as Duns and other schole Doctors say: so that there is a great discrepaunce betwene certayne knowledge, and cleare knowledge: for that may bee of thinges absent that appeare not, thys requyreth the presence of the obiect, I meane of the thing knowen: so that MarginaliaCertaine knowledge. Cleare knowledge.I certaynely and surely know that thing which I perfectly beleue, though I do not clearely and euidently know it. I know your schole subtleties as well as you,MarginaliaM. Latymer not ignorant of the schole subtilities. which dispute as though enigmaticall knowledge, that is to say, darke and obscure knowledge might not be certayne and sure knowledge because it is not cleare, manifest and euident knowledge: and yet there hath bene (they say) qui zelū dei habuerunt sed non secundū scientiā,  

Latin/Greek Translations     Close

Letter from Latimer to Sir Edward Baynton, quoting from Romans, 10. 2.

Foxe text Latin

qui zelum dei habuerunt, sed non secundum scientiam.

[See above page 1913, volumn 1, line 32]

which haue had a zeale, but not after knowledge. Truth it is, there hath bene such, and yet bee to many, to the great hinderaunce of CHRISTSES glory, which nothyng

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