MarginaliaAn 1555. February.MarginaliaThe 2. examination of Maister Rogers.FIrst beyng asked agayne by the lord Chauncelor, whether I would come into one Church with the Byshops and whole realme, as now was concluded by Parliament (in the which all the realme was conuerted to the Catholicke church of Rome) and so receyue the mercy before profered me, arising agayne with the whole realme, out of the schisme and errour in which we had long bene, with recantation of my errors: I answered, that before I coulde not tell what his mercy ment, MarginaliaWinchesters mercy, what it meaneth.but now I vnderstoode that it was a mercy of the Antichristian church of Rome, which I vtterly refused, MarginaliaTo rise to the Pope, is to fall from Christ.and that the rising which he spake of, was a very fall into errour and false doctrine. Also that I had and would be able by Gods grace, to proue that all the doctrine which I had euer taught, was true and catholike, and that by the scriptures and the authoritie of the fathers that lyued 400. yeres after Christes death. He aunswered, that should not, might not, nor ought not be graunted me: for I was but a priuate man, and might not bee heard against the determinatiō of þ^e whole realme. MarginaliaWhatsoeuer is once cōcluded in a Parlament, ought not to be reformed afterward by no doctrine nor the worde of God, by the B. of Winchesters diuinitie.Should (quoth he) when a Parliament hath concluded a thyng, one, or any priuate person haue authority to discusse, whether they had done right or wrong? No that may not be.

I aunswered shortly, that al the lawes of men myght not, neyther could rule the word of God, but that they all must be discussed and iudged thereby, and obey thereto: and my conscience, nor no christian mans could be satisfied with such lawes as disagreed from that worde: and so was willyng to haue said much more, but the L. Chancellor began a long tale to very small purpose, concerning myne answer, to haue defaced me, that there was nothing in me wherefore I should be heard, but arrogancie, pride, and vayneglory. I also graunted myne ignorauncy to be greater then I could expresse, or then he tooke it: but yet that I feared not by Gods assistance and strength, to be able by writing to performe my word, neither was I (I thanked God) so vtterly ignorant, as he would make me, but all was of God, to whom be thankes rendred therfore. MarginaliaThe Bishop of Winchester iudgeth M. Rogers by his owne disease.Proud man was I neuer, nor yet vayne glorious. Al the world knew wel, where and on which side pride, arrogancy, and vayneglory was. It was a poore pride that was or is in vs, god it knoweth.

Then sayd he, that I at the first dash condemned the Queene and the whole Realme, to be of the church of Antichrist, and burdened me highly therewithall. I answered that the Queenes maiesty (God saue her grace) would haue done well inough, if it had not bene for his counsel. He sayd, the Queene went before him, and it was her own motion. I sayd without faile, I neither could nor I would euer beleue it.

MarginaliaD. Aldrise witnesseth with the B. of Winchester.Then sayd D. Aldrise the bishop of Carlile, that they the bishops would beare hym witnes. Yea (quoth I) that I beleue well, and with that the people laughed: For that day there were many, but on the morrow they had kept the dores shut, and would let none in, but the Bishops adherentes and seruauntes, in maner, yea and the first day the thousand man came not in. Then maister Comptroler, and Secretary Bourn, would haue stand vp also to beare wytnes, and dyd.

I sayd it was no great matter: and to say the truth, I thought that they were good helpers thereto themselues: but I ceased to say any more therein, knowyng that they were to strong and mighty of power, and that they should be beleued before me, yea and before our sauiour Christ, and all his prophets and Apostles therto in these days.

Then after many wordes he asked me, what I thought concernyng the blessed sacrament,MarginaliaThe opinion of M. Rogers touching the Sacrament of the body of Christ required. and stoode vp and put of his cap, and al his fellow Bishops (of which there were a great sort new men, of whom I knew few) whether I beleued in the sacrament to be the very body and bloud of our Sauiour Christ that was borne of the virgin Mary, and hanged on the crosse, really and substantially.

I aunswered, I had often tolde him that it was a matter in which I was no medler, and therfore suspected of my brethren to be of a contrary opinion. Notwithstanding, euen as the most part of your doctrine in other poyntes is false, and the defence therof onely by force and cruelty: so in thys matter I thinke it to be as false as the rest. For I cannot vnderstand [really and substantially] to signifie otherwise then corporally: MarginaliaAct. 3.but corporally Christ is onely in heauen, and so cannot Christ be corporally also in your sacrament. And here I somewhat set out his charitie after this sorte: My Lord )quoth I) ye haue delt with me most cruellye. MarginaliaCrueltie shewed without a cause.For ye haue set me in prison without law, and kept me there now almost a yere and a halfe.MarginaliaM. Rogers a yeare and a halfe in duraunce. For I was almost halfe a yere in my house, where I was obedient to you (god knoweth) & spake with no man. And now haue I bene a ful yere in Newgate, at great costes and charges, hauing a wyfe and x. children to find, and I had neuer a peny of my liuinges, which was against the law.

He answered, that Doctor Ridley which had geuen thē me, was an vsurper, and therefore I was the vniust possessour of them.

Was the king then an Vsurper (quoth I) which gaue D. Ridley the bishopricke?

MarginaliaSte. Gardiner calleth k. Edward an vsurper.Yea (quoth he) and began to set out the wronges that the K. had done to the B. of London, and to himselfe also. But yet I do misuse my termes (quoth he) to call the kyng vsurper. But the word was gone out of the aboundance of the hart before: and I thinke that he was not very sory for it in hart. I might haue sayd more concerning that matter, but I did not.

I asked hym wherfore he set me in prison. He said because I preached agaynst the Queene.

I answered that it was not true: and I would be bound to proue it, and to stand to the triall of the lawe, that no man should be able to proue it, and therupon would set my lyfe. MarginaliaM. Rogers imprisoned agaynst all law & right.I preached (quoth I) a Sermon at the Crosse,  

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I.e., Paul's Cross.

Yea, but thou didst read thy lectures after (quoth he) against the commaundement of the Counsell.

That did I not (quoth I): let that be proued and let me dye for it. Thus haue ye now agaynst the law of God & man handled me, and neuer sent for me, neuer cōferred with me, neuer spoke of any learning, till now þ^t ye haue gotten a whip to whip me with, and a sword to cut of my necke, if I will not condescend vnto your mynd. This charitie doth all the world vnderstand.

I might and would haue added, if I could haue bene suffred to speake, that it had bene time enough to take away mens liuings, and therto to haue prisoned them, after that they had offended lawes. For they be good citizens þ^t break not lawes, and worthy of prayse, and not of punishmēt.MarginaliaM. Rogers punished before any law was broken. But their purpose is to kepe mē in prison so long, vntil they may catch them in their lawes, and so kil them. I could & would haue added the example of Daniel, which by a crafty deuised law was cast into the Lions denne. Itē, I might haue declared, that I most humbly desired to be set at liberty, sendyng my wyfe to hym with a Supplication, beyng great with chyld, and with her 8. honest women, or therabout to Richmond, at Christmas was a xij. month, whiles I was yet in my house.

Item, I wrote two supplications to hym out of Newgate, and sent my wife many tymes to hym. M. GosnoldeMarginaliaM. Gosnolde laboured for M. Rogers. also that worthy man, who is now departed in the lorde, laboured for me, and so did diuers other worthy mē also take paynes in the matter. These thinges declare my L. Chauncellors Antichristian charitie, which is, that he hath & doth seeke my bloud, and the destruction of my poore wyfe and my ten children.

This is a short summe of the wordes which were spoken the 28. day of Ianuary at after noone, after that Maister Hoper had ben the first, & M. Cardmaker the second in examination before me. The Lord graunt vs grace to stand together, fighting lawfully in hys cause, till wee be smitten downe together, if the Lordes wyll be so to permit it. For there shall not a heyre of our heades perish agaynst his wil, but with his wyll. Whereunto the same Lord graunte vs to be obedient vnto the ende, and in the end. Amen: Sweete, mighty, and mercifull Lorde Iesus the Sonne of Dauid and of God, Amen, Amen, let euery true Christian saye and pray.

Then the clocke being (as I gessed) about foure, the L. Chauncellor sayd, that he and the Church must yet vse charitie with me (MarginaliaGreat mercy of Winchest. no lesse then the Foxe hath to the chickens, or the Wolfe to sucke the bloud of Lambes.what maner of charitie it is, all true christians do well vnderstand, as to wit, the same that the Foxe doth with the chickens, and the wolfe with the Lambes) and gaue me respite till to morow, to see whether I would remember my selfe well to morrow, and whether I would returne to the catholike church (for so he calleth hys Antichristian false church) againe, and repent, and they would receyue me to mercy.

I sayd that I was neuer out of the true Catholicke Church, nor would be: but into his Church, would I, by gods grace, neuer come.

MarginaliaThe popes church is the church of Antichrist.Well (quoth he) then is our Churche false and Antichristian.

Yea, quoth I.

And what is the doctrine of the sacrament?

False, quoth I, and cast my handes abrode.

Then sayd one, that I was a player. To whom I aunswered not: for I passed not vpon hys mocke.

MarginaliaM. Rogers warned to appeare the next day.Come againe, quoth the Lord Chauncellour, to morrow