1583 Edition | Book 11 | Page 1944 
CloseLeading freewiller. Of Hellingley, Sussex.
John Careless received a letter from John Bradford which mentioned Trew. 1570, p. 1827, 1576, p. 1563, 1583, p. 1645.
During his examination by Thomas Martyn, John Careless defended the doctrine of Trew. 1563, p. 1530, 1570, p. 2102, 1576, p. 1813, 1583, p. 1920.
Henry Adlington received a letter from John Careless which mentioned 'John T.' 1570, pp. 2110-12, 1576, pp. 1833-34, 1583, pp. 1928-29.
John Trew was persecuted by Sir Edward Gage and imprisoned, pilloried and had his ears cut off. 1563, p. 1681.
[An undated petition of John Trew in Elizabeth's reign to Elizabeth's commissioners in the counties of Surrey and Sussex said that Sir Edward Gage, 'an extreme persecutor of the gospel', had placed John Trewe in the pillory in the market towns of Lewes and Hailsham and had his ears cut off. Trew petitioned that Gage compensate him. (Historical Manuscripts Commission Reports, vol.7, p. 665.)]
[Back to Top][For Trew as a freewiller, see Thomas S. Freeman, 'Dissenters from a Dissenting Church: The Challenge of the Freewillers, 1550-1558' in The Beginnings of English Protestantism, ed. Peter Marshall and Alec Ryrie (Cambridge, 2002), pp. 136-39.]
[Trew was the author of an important account of conflicts between predestinarians and freewillers in Mary's reign. See Richard Laurence, ed., Authentic Documents (Oxford, 1819), pp. 37-70.]
[Escaped from prison in June 1556. (BL, Add.Ms.19400, fo.67v APC 1554-1556 V, p. 316.)]
Close(1525? - 1583)
Lord Fitzwalter ['Fitzwaters'] and, from 1557, earl of Sussex. Diplomat, Courtier, and Lord Deputy of Ireland (DNB).
Thomas Radcliffe was present at Gardiner's sermon, 30 September 1554. Called 'Lord Fitzwaters' by Foxe (1570, p. 1644; 1576, p. 1402; 1583, p. 1473).
During John Careless' first examination, Martin pretended, according to Foxe, to desire to help Careless survive. He asked Careless if he would like to go to Ireland with Lord Fitzwalter to do the queen's service, to which Careless replied that he was willing to do the queen service as long as he was alive. 1563, p. 1534, 1570, pp. 2101-02, 1576, pp. 1813-14, 1583, pp. 1919-20.
[Back to Top]Thomas Rose had a talk with the earl of Sussex, Sir William Woodhouse and other chaplains. 1570, p. 1979, 1576, pp. 1979-80, 1583, p. 2085.
Thomas Rose's last appearance was before Woodhouse and Hopton, with the earl of Sussex in attendance. 1570, p. 1979, 1576, pp. 1980-81, 1583, pp. 2085-86.
CloseAt the end of his first examination, Careless was told by Martin that he was one of the most pleasant protestants he had talked to 'except it were Tomson'. 1563, p. 1534, 1570, pp. 2101-02, 1576, pp. 1813-14, 1583, pp. 1919-20.
MarginaliaAnno 1556. Iuly.Careles. I thanke your good Maystershippe most hartely: And I put you out of doubt, that I am most sure and certayne of my saluation by Iesus Christ: so that my soule is safe already what so euer paynes my body suffer here for a litle time.
Mart. Yea Mary, you say trueth. For thou art so predestinate to life, that thou canst not perish, in whatsoeuer opinion thou doest dye.
Careles. That GOD hath predestinate me to eternall life in Iesus Christ, I am most certayne, and euen so am I sure that his holy spirite (wherewith I am sealed) will so preserue me from all heresies & euill opinions, that I shall dye in none at all.
MarginaliaIohn Careles examined vpon predestination.Mart. Go to, let me heare your fayth in predestination. For that shalbe written also.
Careles. Your Maystership shall pardon me herein. For you sayd your selfe erewhile, that you had no Commission to examine my conscience. I will trouble my selfe wyth aunswering of no moe matters then I needes must, vntil I come before them that shall haue more authority farther to examine me.
MarginaliaDoct. Martyn declareth his Commission.Mart. I tell thee then I haue Commission: yea, and commaundement from the Counsell to examine thee: for they deliuered me thy articles.
Careles. Yea I thinke in deede that your Maystershippe is appointed to examine me of my articles whiche you haue there in writing and I haue told you the truth. I do confesse them to be mine owne fact and deede: but you do now examine me of predestination, whereof my articles speaketh nothing at all.
[Back to Top]Martin. I tell thee yet agayne, that I muste also examine thee of such thinges as be in controuersye betweene thee & thy fellowes in the Kings Bench, whereof predestination is a part, as thy fellow N. hath confessed and thy selfe doest not deny it.
Carel. I do not deny it. But he that first told you that matter, might haue found himselfe much better occupyed.
Martyn. Why? what if he had not told me? thinkest thou I would not haue knowē it? yes, or els thou shouldest haue withstand my Commission. MarginaliaWhy Doct. Martyn woulde not examine him of the Sacrament.For I tell thee truthe, I may now examine thee of the blessed Sacrament, or any other thing that I list, but that I would shew thee fauour, and not be to hasty with thee at the first.
[Back to Top]Marshall. Yea in deede Careles, Maister Doctor hath Cōmission to examine you or any other of your fellowes.
Mart. Yea mary haue I, I tell the truth of it.
Carel. Then let your Scribe set his pen to the paper, and you shall haue it roundly euen as the truth is. I beleeue þt almightye God our moste deare louing father of his great mercy and infinite goodnes, did elect in Christ.
Mart. Tush, what neede all that long circumstance? write, I beleeue that God elected and make no more adoe.
Carel. No, not so M. Doctour. It is an high mistery, and ought reuerently to be spoken of. And if my wordes may not be written as I do vtter them, I wil not speake at all.
Mart. Go to, go to, write what he will. Here is more busines then needeth.
MarginaliaCareles opinion of Gods election.Careles. I beleeue that Almighty GOD our moste deare louing Father, of his greate mercy and infinite goodnesse (thorough Iesus Christ) did elect and appoynt in him before the foūdation of the earth was layd, a Church or congregation, which he doth continually guide and gouerne by his grace and holy spirite, so that not one of them shall euer finally perishe. When this was written, M. Doctor tooke it in his hand and read it, saying.
[Back to Top]MarginaliaDoctour Martyn auoweth Careles iudgement of Gods election.Mart. Why? who will deny this?
Carel. If your Maistership doe allow it and other learned men when they shall see it, I haue my hartes desyer.
Mart. And do you hold none otherwise, thē is there writtē?
Carel. No verily, nor neuer did.
Mart. Write that he sayth, otherwise he holdeth not. So þt was written. It was told me also that thou doest affirme, that Christ did not dye effectually for all men.
Carel Whatsoeuer hath bene told you it is not much materiall vnto me. Let the tellers of such tales come before my face, and I trust to make them aunswere. For in deede I do beleeue þt Christe did effectually dye for all those that do effectually repent and beleeue, and for none other: so that was written also.
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CloseAt this point, the portion of the Careless examination reprinted in the 1570 edition, and all subsequent editions, begins.
Carel. No forsooth that doth he not.
Mart How then?
MarginaliaA wrong fayth of Predestination beleeuing to be elected in respect of good workes.Carel Truely I thinke he doth beleeue as your Maistershyp and the rest of the Clergy do beleeue of predestinatiō, that we bee elected in respecte of our good workes, and so long elected, as we do them, and no longer.
Martyn. Write that he sayth, his fellow Trew beleeueth of predestination as the Papistes do beleeue.
Carel. Ah Maister Doctour, did I so terme you? Seing that this my confession shall come before the Counsell, I pray you place my termes as reuerently as I spake them.
Mart Well, well, write that Trew is of the same fayth as the Catholickes be.
Carel. I did not so call you neyther, I wonder what you meane.
Marshal. You sayd the Clergy, did you not Careles?
Carel. Yes forsooth did I. So then it was written of the Clergy.
Mart. Now Syr, what say you more?
Carel. Forsooth I haue no farther to say in this matter.
Mart. Well, Careles I pray thee proue thy selfe a wise man and do not cast away thy lyfe wilfully.
Carel. Now the Lord he knoweth, good Maister Doctor, I would full gladly liue, so that I might do the same with a safe conscience. And your Maistershippe shall right well perceiue that I will be no wilfull man, but in all thinges that I stand vpon I will haue a sure grounde.
MarginaliaD. Martyn pretendeth fauor to Careles.Martin. Now the Lorde knoweth, good Careles, that I would gladly make some meanes to preserue thy lyfe: but thou speakest so much of the Lord, the Lord. Wilt thou be content to go with my Lord Fitzwater into Ireland? me thinkes thou art a goodly tall fellow to do the Queene seruice there. How sayest thou?
[Back to Top]Carel. Verely Maister Doctour, whether I be in Ireland, Fraunce, or Spayne, or any place els, I am ready to do her grace the best seruice that I can, with body, goodes and lyfe, so long as it doth last.
Mart. That is honestly sayde, I promise thee euery man will not say so. How say you Maister Marshall, this man is meete for all manner of seruice. In deede thou arte worthey Careles, to haue the more fauour.
Carel. In deede Syr, I hope to be meete and ready vnto all things that pertayneth vnto a true Christian subiect to doe. And if her grace or her officers vnder her do require me to any thing contrary to Christes Religion, I am ready also to do my seruice in Smithfield for not obseruing it, as my bedfellow and other brethren haue done, praysed be God for them.
[Back to Top]Mart. By my trouth thou art a pleasaunt fellow as euer I talked with of all the Protestantes, excepte it were Tomson
CloseThis may be a reference to Harold Thomson, a priest who was arrested along with Edward Crome, John Hooper and John Rogers on 22 January 1555 (The Diary of Henry Machyn 1550-1563, ed. J. G. Nichols, Camden Society, 42 [1848], p. 80). More likely the martyr Thomas Tomkins is meant.
Careles. No Maister Doctour, that is not so. MarginaliaMore variety in the Popes Church, then is amongest the Protestantes.There is a thousand tymes more varietye in opinions among your Doctours, which you call of þe Catholick Church, yea and that in the Sacrament for þe which there is so much bloudshed now a dayes. I meane of your latter Doctours and new writers: as for the olde they agree wholy with vs.
[Back to Top]Mart. No Careles this is not so: there thou art deceiued.
Carel. Verily it is so, Maister Doctour. I am not deceiued therein any thing at all, as it hath beene, and is euidently proued by such as GOD hath endued with great learning. Then he turned to the Marshall, and whispered with him a while.
Martin. Turning vnto me agayne sayd: MarginaliaDoctour Martin taketh his leaue gently of Careles.Farewell Careles, for I can tarry no longer with thee now, my busines is such.
Carel. God be with you, good Maister Doctor. The Lord geue your Maistership health of body and soule.
Mart. God haue mercy good Careles and God keepe thee from all errours, and geue thee grace to doe as well as I would wishe my selfe.
Carel. I thanke your good Maistership. I pray God I may do alwaies that is acceptable in his sight. Whereunto they all sayde, Amen. And so I departed with a glad hart: God onely haue the whole prayse, Amen.
It appeareth by the examination of the foresayd Iohn Careles, that he endured prisoner the space of two whole yeares hauing wyfe and children. In the which his captiuity, first being in Couentry Iayle, he was there in such credite with his keeper, þt vpon his worde he was let out to play in the Pageant about the City wt other his companions. And that done, keeping touch wt his keeper, he returned agayne into prison at his houre appointed.
[Back to Top]And after that being broughte vp to London he was indued with such patience and constaunt fortitude, that he longed for nothing more earnestly, then to come to þe promotion to dye in the fyer
Close"I am alredy proclaimed," he writes in his third letter to K. E., "heretike at Paule's crosse, I prayse God most hartely for it. For nowe I knowe I shal shortly be with him, for whose sake I am so called; and shall be yet more solemnely the Sunday after Trinity Sunday, doctor Harpesfield saith." See Bishop Ridley's Pituous Lamentation, printed by Th. Powell, "with certeyne letters of J. Careless," 1566.
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